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Rainy Saturday. [message #3175]

Sat, 01 November 2008 21:43

b_twin_1
Messages: 2594
Registered: September 2008
Location: Victoria, Australia

Senior Member
[Moderator]

Rainy Saturday. Make that very rainy.

I've got a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a weasel ~ Blackadder

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3176 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 21:52

b_twin_1
Messages: 2594
Registered: September 2008
Location: Victoria, Australia

Senior Member
[Moderator]

‡ We’ve been having a little light banter about a review of CHALICE that has it listed as for ‘grades 7 to 10′. Yo! You out there! If you’re over 16, put that book down!

HA! Not blinking likely. Razz

I'll set my dog onto anyone who tries to take it away .....

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3248/2994072246_3fbdc2831f.jpg?v=0

I've got a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a weasel ~ Blackadder

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3177 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 22:10

holmes44
Messages: 706
Registered: October 2008
Location: Sutton,Quebec

Senior Member

i love you dog, is he or she a collie.

Bonnie Holmes the faster ahead I go, the more behind I get

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3178 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 22:13

jmeadows
Messages: 3149
Registered: September 2008
Location: Virginia, USA

Senior Member
[Moderator]

Quote:

Yo! You out there! If you’re over 16, put that book down!

No. It's mine now!

(Or Suzi's.)

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3143/2951829837_9b8cd4c895.jpg?v=0

Southdowner, better get Hazel up, too. Can't let b_twin_1 and me just get away with copying your idea, can you???

Smooshes!

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3181 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 22:40

blondviolinist
Messages: 1067
Registered: October 2008
Location: Midwestern United States

Senior Member

Yo! You out there! If you’re over 16, put that book down!

Looks over shoulder, finishes last page of book, then furtively sets book on table.

Who, me? The book is down. I wasn't holding it. I don't haunt the Young Adult part of my library because that's where all the good books are. Nope, not me.

(Will someone please explain to me why most of Robin's books are in the YA section of my library, several are in the Fantasy/SciFi section, and Sunshine is in the regular adult fiction section? This makes no sense to me whatsoever.)

"Purity of heart is to will one thing." Kirkegaard

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3182 is a reply to message #3181 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 22:47

handyhunter
Messages: 61
Registered: October 2008

Member

blondviolinist wrote on Sat, 01 November 2008 22:40

(Will someone please explain to me why most of Robin's books are in the YA section of my library, several are in the Fantasy/SciFi section, and Sunshine is in the regular adult fiction section? This makes no sense to me whatsoever.)

Weird. But maybe it'll find a larger audience that way? I tend to find Sunshine in the horror section (I guess because of the vampires).

with a wide open country in my eyes
and these romantic dreams in my head - No Surrender, Bruce Springsteen

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3183 is a reply to message #3181 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 22:52

jmeadows
Messages: 3149
Registered: September 2008
Location: Virginia, USA

Senior Member
[Moderator]

blondviolinist wrote on Sat, 01 November 2008 22:40

Marketing. Smile

Sunshine is usually in the regular SFF section, as is Deerskin. The others sometimes appear in YA because Marketing likes them there.

In your area, Sunshine might have been mis-shelved, or the bookstore people might have thought it'd sell better there.

Smooshes!

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3184 is a reply to message #3182 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 23:00

blondviolinist
Messages: 1067
Registered: October 2008
Location: Midwestern United States

Senior Member

I'm not sure if it'll find a larger audience there or not. I've never cared to look to see where they stick the Anne Rice books. The regular adult fiction section is usually the last place in the library you'll find me: I'm usually in Fantasy/SciFi, Mystery, YA, or Children's section. (Though I must have Horatio Hornblower novels from time to time.)

This is the same library that puts horror movies together with fantasy movies. I'm sorry, but I don't want to wade through Saw III and Jeepers Creepers II on my way to the Neverending Story.

I need to stop complaining about my library. It's actually a very wonderful library, one of the best I've ever been privileged to use. They've got a great selection, knowledgeable and helpful staff, a new and inviting building, and they let you bring coffee inside. The strange shelving choices are a bit of an anomaly.

"Purity of heart is to will one thing." Kirkegaard

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3185 is a reply to message #3184 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 23:10

handyhunter
Messages: 61
Registered: October 2008

Member

blondviolinist wrote on Sat, 01 November 2008 23:00

Me too. Apparently, though, there are people who dare not venture into genre-land... Diana Gabaldon has been trying to get her books out of romance for years because she says she gets a wider (ie, male) audience when her books are shelved in the general fiction section instead (or as well).

with a wide open country in my eyes
and these romantic dreams in my head - No Surrender, Bruce Springsteen

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3186 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 23:15

Katherine
Messages: 72
Registered: October 2008
Location: Michigan, The States

Member

Quote:

We've been having a little light banter about a review of CHALICE that has it listed as for "grades 7 to 10". Yo! You out there! If you're over 16, put that book down!

I feel an enormous rant coming on. Stop now if you don't want to read it.

Oh, oh, OH!!! This makes me so angry! I'm sorry, but there's nothing about this book that says YA. Not that I think it shouldn't be read by young readers, mind you, but come on--there aren't even any teenagers IN the book that I can recall. So why, why, why should it even begin at grade seven much less stop at grade ten?! I've said this before and I know I'm not alone, but I despise that kind of pigeonholing. I work in publishing and I STILL find it inexplicable. Not to mention utterly stupid.

*pantpant*

Okay, sorry. Carry on. Laugh, lest you cry. Light banter. Allow me to raise my blood pressure so you don't have to. Smile

Every day for the next year, I'm taking and posting at least one picture. Stop by and take a look!

http://project365lummox.blogspot.com

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3187 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 23:25

Maureen E
Messages: 111
Registered: October 2008
Location: Indiana, USA

Senior Member

Quote:

‡ We’ve been having a little light banter about a review of CHALICE that has it listed as for ‘grades 7 to 10′. Yo! You out there! If you’re over 16, put that book down!

I'm short. I bet I could pass for 16...

More seriously, 10th grade? Really? I'm puzzled.

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3188 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sat, 01 November 2008 23:30

ssshunt
Messages: 746
Registered: October 2008
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

Senior Member

This makes me crazy as well. When I tried to find Dragonhaven, I figured it would be in the SFF section as usual. I asked for help, and got a real know-it-all for an "information guide." She told me Dragonhaven was a child's book, therefore it is in the child's section. And I said why? And she went on to explain blah blah blah so finally I said, The Hero and the Crown is in SFF, and she said, that's not a YA book. And I said then how did it win the Newberry? And she finally shut up. This makes me crazy too. Granted Dragonhaven and Sunshine are worlds apart, but the marketing pigeonholing makes me want to scream.

What platform is your book suited for? Oh, I get death in my eye when asked that.

[Updated on: Sat, 01 November 2008 23:31]

"And by the way you look fantastic in your boots of Chinese plastic."

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3192 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 00:06

librarykat
Messages: 566
Registered: October 2008
Location: Redneck Riviera

Senior Member

Unfortunately, it seems that review journals have to pigeon-hole books into certain age ranges. I review for Booklist, and I have to use some rather rigid age ranges that don't always correspond to what I think the book should have. And many of Robin's books are in YA because of Blue Sword and Hero and the Crown getting those Newbery Honor and Newbery Award medals. However, instead of complaining about where the books are shelved, we should be happy the libraries have Robin's books! We want more people to read them! And discerning readers don't CARE where the book is shelved in the library, or what age range had to be applied by publisher, book reviewer, or whoever. And yes, I'm a librarian, have been one for decades, but I was a Robin McKinley fan first.

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3193 is a reply to message #3188 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 00:09

librarykat
Messages: 566
Registered: October 2008
Location: Redneck Riviera

Senior Member

ssshunt wrote on Sat, 01 November 2008 22:30

Was this in a bookstore? My local Books-a-Million shelved the hardcover of Dragonhaven in the children's section, which drove me bonkers (at least put it in Teen, for crying out loud!). However, the store redeemed itself by shelving the paperback in Science Fiction and Fantasy. Chalice is in the Teen section, which is okay by me; it's in good company, together with Nancy Werlin's Impossible and Kristin Cashore's Graceling.

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3197 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 01:49

Diane in MN
Messages: 2729
Registered: October 2008
Location: Twin Cities, MN, USA

Senior Member

And as I wrote to Merrilee a little later that morning,‡ I rang a quarter peal last night and had a lovely ride on Connie this morning, and I’m so swollen with self-satisfaction that I’d better get to work fast before I explode.

But isn't it nice to have a chance to feel self-satisfied every now and then, when the gods make a mistake and several things in a row go right?

We’ve been having a little light banter about a review of CHALICE that has it listed as for ‘grades 7 to 10′.

Snork! I'd be interested to know if there's any real data that supports the value/usefulness of these marketing categories. I've been ignoring them since I was in elementary school, and so have all the readers I know.

_{"The point of books is to have way too many but to always feel you never have enough . . . " Louise Erdrich}

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3199 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 01:21

L.R.K.
Messages: 1080
Registered: October 2008
Location: Sweden

Senior Member

More food for annnoy- I mean, thought:

http://www.fromrimtohub.com/499/pullman-pratchett-empotterem -author-denounce-age-banding-childrens-books/

Why, I feel all thin, sort of stretched, if you know what I mean, like butter that has been scraped over too much bread.

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3204 is a reply to message #3177 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 01:50

b_twin_1
Messages: 2594
Registered: September 2008
Location: Victoria, Australia

Senior Member
[Moderator]

holmes44 wrote on Sat, 01 November 2008 22:10

i love you dog, is he or she a collie.

She is a Sheltie (Shetland Sheepdog).
And yes. She worked sheep in her day. Smile

I've got a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a weasel ~ Blackadder

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3206 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 01:53

L.R.K.
Messages: 1080
Registered: October 2008
Location: Sweden

Senior Member

She looks very wise - and she looks as if she wouldn't put up with any nonsense from any sheep... Smile

Why, I feel all thin, sort of stretched, if you know what I mean, like butter that has been scraped over too much bread.

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3210 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 02:45

danceswithpahis
Messages: 380
Registered: October 2008

Senior Member

"The only reason I don’t shut the piano lid on my hands is because the music stand folds down over it. I am waiting to find out how to have a sudden incomprehensible spasm which will lift the music stand off its hooks, fling it at myself in a flurry of sheet music and manuscript pages, and drop the piano lid, all in one never-to-be-forgotten manoeuvre."

Okay, I had to laugh at this, because it's so true! While I have never quite managed to drop a piano lid on my hands, I swear I can remember doing things like somehow managing to drop a hymnal or other heavy music book off the music stand (always a part of the piano on the ones I've played) and knocking it onto the piano lid, catching it just barely through sudden reflex.

"Oh good! My dog found the chainsaw!"

-- Lilo ("Lilo and Stitch")

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3211 is a reply to message #3206 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 04:31

b_twin_1
Messages: 2594
Registered: September 2008
Location: Victoria, Australia

Senior Member
[Moderator]

L.R.K. wrote on Sun, 02 November 2008 01:53

She looks very wise - and she looks as if she wouldn't put up with any nonsense from any sheep... Smile

LOL Not a chance!

I've got a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a weasel ~ Blackadder

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3216 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 05:28

Susan from Athens
Messages: 817
Registered: October 2008
Location: Athens, Greece

Senior Member

The age thing is ridiculous. I was reading whatever I felt like from the age of 12, although I admit some of the stuff I read would have horrified my parents it did me no permanent harm. At least I don't think it did. My warped sense of humour and peculiar aesthetics would have come about regardless Smile

What I worry about in this post is this

"for the first ten minutes or so my shoulder was saying Twinge. I mean it, stupid. And then it stopped."

The question is, did it remain stopped? Or is it now throbbing in double time. Sometime exercise is just what an injury needs, sometimes it just exacerbates it. When it is all warm you don't feel the pain, but once it cools down - yikes. I hope that all is well and will light a candle. But full as Robin is with self satisfaction, she probably won't need chocolate or champagne ***whistles innocently, taking a page out of b_twin_1's book - which she hopes is suitable for forty-one year olds***

_{“I have always imagined heaven to be a kind of library.” –Jorge Luis Borges}

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3218 is a reply to message #3216 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 05:39

b_twin_1
Messages: 2594
Registered: September 2008
Location: Victoria, Australia

Senior Member
[Moderator]

Susan from Athens wrote on Sun, 02 November 2008 05:28

But full as Robin is with self satisfaction, she probably won't need chocolate or champagne ***whistles innocently, taking a page out of b_twin_1's book - which she hopes is suitable for forty-one year olds***

snork

I'm not that far behind you. *g* But hey. Any excuse for chocolate Wink

I've got a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a weasel ~ Blackadder

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3221 is a reply to message #3176 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 06:57

southdowner
Messages: 981
Registered: September 2008
Location: England

Senior Member
[Moderator]

b_twin_1 wrote on Sun, 02 November 2008 01:52

I'll set my dog onto anyone who tries to take it away .....

:: waving from England :: Hazel says "Hi!"

Someone says "pie" and we all go on alert, like meercats. "Pie? Where?" - Blackbear

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3222 is a reply to message #3178 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 06:58

southdowner
Messages: 981
Registered: September 2008
Location: England

Senior Member
[Moderator]

"Yaay" ferrets too!!!
Can we start a book club for animals who read Robin books??

Here's Hazel to join in Smile

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3178/2867065603_a013a60ce3.jpg?v=1221742944

[Updated on: Sun, 02 November 2008 07:04]

Someone says "pie" and we all go on alert, like meercats. "Pie? Where?" - Blackbear

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3223 is a reply to message #3222 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 07:06

Susan from Athens
Messages: 817
Registered: October 2008
Location: Athens, Greece

Senior Member

southdowner wrote on Sun, 02 November 2008 13:58

"Yaay" ferrets too!!!
Can we start a book club for animals who read Robin books??

Robin's McPetties?

_{“I have always imagined heaven to be a kind of library.” –Jorge Luis Borges}

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3224 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 07:13

southdowner
Messages: 981
Registered: September 2008
Location: England

Senior Member
[Moderator]

Which is another of these Rather Tall Girl on Rather Small Pony situations. There are several of them at Jenny’s yard.

I've met several of this species, many of whom fall into the category of post teen girls who have out-grown ponies but can't bear to pass them on - and most of these small ponies carried their owners without any struggle, but not always most elegantly - ... and one of them was me Smile

what a great description of bell ringing - remind me, what is the reason to do this? Wink

Someone says "pie" and we all go on alert, like meercats. "Pie? Where?" - Blackbear

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3227 is a reply to message #3188 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 08:40

Mrs Redboots
Messages: 943
Registered: October 2008
Location: London, UK

Senior Member

ssshunt wrote on Sun, 02 November 2008 03:30

I asked my daughter, who was on holiday in the USA with her husband, to buy me a copy of Chalice, and told her to look in the SFF section. A few days later we were chatting on Facebook and she told me she'd found the book, but she'd had to ask, and it had been in the Young Adult section, not the SFF section. (Subtext, you could hear: Silly Mummy, fancy sending me to the wrong place and making me have to ask!).

Robin wrote

If I Ignore It It Isn’t Happening/It Didn’t Happen/It Doesn’t Hurt/I’m Fine/That’s Not Blood There’s Something Wrong with Your Eyes/ and Don’t Mention It On The Blog Because That Counts As Paying Attention. For any clever, careful, adept, talented, thoughtful, responsible people out there who are going, WTF?, hey, sometimes it works.

Would someone please tell that to my left leg, which was showing definite signs of A Tweaked Calf Muscle at skating this morning? I was definitely trying to Ignore It, but it doesn't really want to be ignored....

Mrs Redboots
I love my computer because my friends live in it!

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3228 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 08:51

Black Bear
Messages: 3216
Registered: September 2008
Location: Indianapolis, IN USA

Senior Member
[Moderator]

Regret to say that none of the cats have shown an interest in reading Chalice... But I thought I caught the fish looking longingly through the glass at it last week.

And I ignored it, which is the first line of defense against stupid injury, as many of you other klutzim out there will know.

*SNRKKK*

The only reason I don’t shut the piano lid on my hands is because the music stand folds down over it.

This is called a Safety Feature. Smile

I seem to recall falling off the edge of the piano bench once as a child--back in the days of forced lessons--and thinking that perhaps a seat belt might be another handy Feature for this instrument.

[Updated on: Sun, 02 November 2008 08:58]

_{"The time is always right to do what's right."--MLK Jr.}

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3234 is a reply to message #3193 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 11:19

ssshunt
Messages: 746
Registered: October 2008
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

Senior Member

Yes, it was in a bookstore. One I frequent. But they do make me crazy with what goes where. I have to use the information desk too often. Once I came in looking for Ellwand's Faereality, and they had it in fashion. Which was pretty cool in a way. But mostly they make me crazy.

"And by the way you look fantastic in your boots of Chinese plastic."

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3236 is a reply to message #3204 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 11:25

holmes44
Messages: 706
Registered: October 2008
Location: Sutton,Quebec

Senior Member

b_twin_1 wrote on Sun, 02 November 2008 01:50

holmes44 wrote on Sat, 01 November 2008 22:10

i love you dog, is he or she a collie.

She is a Sheltie (Shetland Sheepdog).
And yes. She worked sheep in her day. Smile

she is beautiful and i bet that she showed the sheep who was the boss.

Bonnie Holmes the faster ahead I go, the more behind I get

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3256 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 15:21

ssshunt
Messages: 746
Registered: October 2008
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

Senior Member

Today here it's rainy Sunday. Coming down in buckets, and the mountains are getting snow. OK, we get it, it's November! Sheesh.

"And by the way you look fantastic in your boots of Chinese plastic."

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3266 is a reply to message #3256 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 16:03

Susan from Athens
Messages: 817
Registered: October 2008
Location: Athens, Greece

Senior Member

We were thirty degrees today. I just spent the evening on a girlfriend's terrace, having tea and cake, with a view of the Acropolis floodlit before us. It is NOVEMBER, for goodness sake. We shouldn't even have wanted to go out on the terrace to look at the view, let alone sit there for two hours, in sleeveless tops. And I spent the day getting down my woollens, because I know that one day I will wake up and be frozen. ***Sigh*** climatological vicissitudes.

_{“I have always imagined heaven to be a kind of library.” –Jorge Luis Borges}

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3268 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 16:08

ssshunt
Messages: 746
Registered: October 2008
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

Senior Member

Must remember 30 C, not 30 F. BIG difference. For a minute there, Susan, I thought you were out of your mind.

Of course it's pushing 35 F here...

"And by the way you look fantastic in your boots of Chinese plastic."

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3275 is a reply to message #3268 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 16:16

blondviolinist
Messages: 1067
Registered: October 2008
Location: Midwestern United States

Senior Member

I had the same response, with the added confusion of "Why would somebody be using Celsius if they're from Georgia, US? Oh, wait... Athens, Greece!"

I'm slow today.

"Purity of heart is to will one thing." Kirkegaard

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3280 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 16:46

ssshunt
Messages: 746
Registered: October 2008
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

Senior Member

Ah, the OTHER Athens.

"And by the way you look fantastic in your boots of Chinese plastic."

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3281 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 16:51

Lissla Lissar
Messages: 6
Registered: October 2008
Location: Under a pile of books

Junior Member

You know, I think I'll never take up ringing. The combination of kluztiness, myopia, and EXTREME lack of any musical ability look like I wouldn't be a winner.

I defiantly shelved Robin books in sf, at work. Of course, The Time-Traveler's Wife and Anne Rice and Jules Verne and Chelsea Quinn Yarbro go in fiction...

Sigh.

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3283 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 17:04

ssshunt
Messages: 746
Registered: October 2008
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah

Senior Member

Don't get me started.

"And by the way you look fantastic in your boots of Chinese plastic."

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3284 is a reply to message #3268 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 17:25

Susan from Athens
Messages: 817
Registered: October 2008
Location: Athens, Greece

Senior Member

ssshunt wrote on Sun, 02 November 2008 23:08

Must remember 30 C, not 30 F. BIG difference. For a minute there, Susan, I thought you were out of your mind.

Of course it's pushing 35 F here...

Hah, Celsius, of course. Was watering all my balcony plants today and getting overheated (me and the plants too). They think it is spring again. All our biological temperature scales are a bit wacky.

Blond violinist: no, not Georgia. I have nothing against the southern US, but I am from the ORIGINAL Athens. (Slight bit of cultural snobbism there, but our city hasa been around for three and a half thousand years or so and we're PROUD of that fact). Smile

And no, Shelley, if it were 30 F I would be shut inside wrapped in all the knitted things I could find. We ain't trained to deal with such cold in our lil' ole town.

_{“I have always imagined heaven to be a kind of library.” –Jorge Luis Borges}

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3286 is a reply to message #3284 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 17:34

blondviolinist
Messages: 1067
Registered: October 2008
Location: Midwestern United States

Senior Member

Yeah, if I lived in Athens, Greece, I think I'd want to indulge in light snobbery as well Wink

"Purity of heart is to will one thing." Kirkegaard

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Re: Rainy Saturday. [message #3306 is a reply to message #3175 ]

Sun, 02 November 2008 18:10

Ithilien
Messages: 701
Registered: September 2008

Senior Member
[Moderator]

Yo! You out there! If you’re over 16, put that book down!

Hahahaha. I don't think so. Mine! All mine!

Well, one of them anyway. The other copy is going to my sister for Christmas.

*contemplates the pretty pictures of pets with artistically placed forelimbs on copies of CHALICE*

I think I may refrain from trying this out on the bird. He, uh, loves paper. He loves chewing paper. (Refer to above statements on ownership of book.)

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